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Thursday, December 24, 2009

[Type-2-Diabetes] Digest Number 3833

Messages In This Digest (19 Messages)

Messages

1a.

Re: Newly diagnosed, and new to the group

Posted by: "Holly Shaltz" holly@shaltzfarm.com   hollyshaltz

Wed Dec 23, 2009 4:46 am (PST)



In my experience, my BP came down to normal levels
as I controlled my BGs and lost weight. Hopefully
that will be Amanda's experience, as well (if she
needs to lose weight like most of us :)

Holly in MI

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1b.

Re: Newly diagnosed, and new to the group

Posted by: "AnaLog Services, Inc." analog@logwell.com   sydlevine

Wed Dec 23, 2009 5:51 am (PST)



Those things can help, but often that is not enough. High BP is nothing to fool around with. There has been discussion about Beta Blockers and Ace Inhibitors for everyone over 50 in the UK, but it is not likely to actually happen. If all the folks on statins were taking Beta Blockers, I betcha the number of reduced cardiac events would be an order of magnitude better than those touted for statins. I am a big fan of controlling BP since it has probably extended my life for these last several years.

We do not know what is causing the high BP of our new friend. It could be nothing more than white coat syndrome. But she is young for high BP and it needs to be looked at seriously.

----- Original Message -----
From: Holly Shaltz
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 7:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Type-2-Diabetes] Newly diagnosed, and new to the group

In my experience, my BP came down to normal levels
as I controlled my BGs and lost weight. Hopefully
that will be Amanda's experience, as well (if she
needs to lose weight like most of us :)

Holly in MI

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Messages in this topic (6)
1c.

Re: Newly diagnosed, and new to the group

Posted by: "Diane Moro" deemoro@gmail.com   signoradiana

Thu Dec 24, 2009 3:35 am (PST)



My husband is not diabetic, he has asthma and high BP, must take a med to
control it and also btw he is not overweight. I also have thin friends who
are hypertensive, one of which is so much so she is on three meds to control
it! She is younger than me and very thin and active, so please let's not
blame the weight for everything. I'm fat and my BP is always normal.
So BP meds are a must for everyone who is diagnosed hypertensive. Thin, fat,
diabetic or not.
I'm glad that you, Holly, were able to get it normal with your diet. That's
not the case of a lot of people I know.

~diane

On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 7:47 AM, Holly Shaltz <holly@shaltzfarm.com> wrote:

> In my experience, my BP came down to normal levels
> as I controlled my BGs and lost weight. Hopefully
> that will be Amanda's experience, as well (if she
> needs to lose weight like most of us :)
>
> Holly in MI
>
>
>
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Messages in this topic (6)
2a.

Re: Vitamin D

Posted by: "Richard" rfine999@yahoo.com   rfine999

Wed Dec 23, 2009 5:46 am (PST)





--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com, "faestion1" <neichan22@...> wrote:

> I was wondering, has anyone else had a Vitamin D level checked? Apparently diabetics are notorious for having low levels. Low Vitamin D has numerous negative effects on our health, not the least of which is weak bones. But there is a huge list of other effects it can have.
>
>

I had no idea until now that vitamin D deficiency went along with diabetes, but about a year ago my doctor told me I was deficient and said to take 2000mg a day.

Rich in NY

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2b.

Re: Vitamin D

Posted by: "Jude" peridotjude@yahoo.com   peridotjude

Wed Dec 23, 2009 7:26 am (PST)



--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com, "Richard" <rfine999@...> wrote:
I had no idea until now that vitamin D deficiency went along with diabetes, but about a year ago my doctor told me I was deficient and said to take 2000mg a day. Rich in NY>

I's not a known complication of diabetes as far as I've ever heard. But it seems as though the docs are testing middle aged and older folks for vitamin D deficiency now, and of course, a lot of us are also diabetic. The two things are not connected, AFAIK.
Judy D.

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3a.

Re: Daughter in law has increased glucose

Posted by: "rodneyyah" rodneyyah@yahoo.com   rodneyyah

Wed Dec 23, 2009 5:47 am (PST)



NBC's "Biggest Loser" has shown several people who came off their meds during the show.
 

--- On Tue, 12/22/09, Tricia <psimmons1219@gmail.com> wrote:

 
Does anyone know if you can come of diabetes medicine if you lose enough weight. 

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4.

LINK Re: sugar free cookies

Posted by: "Thompson, Cheryl (AHRQ/OCKT)" cheryl.thompson@ahrq.hhs.gov   cherylspeaks

Wed Dec 23, 2009 5:49 am (PST)



Link for sugar free cookies...
http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/paula-deen/magical-peanut-butter-cookies-recipe/index.html




cheryl

________________________________

From: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com on behalf of NeNeen
Sent: Tue 12/22/2009 8:28 PM
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Type-2-Diabetes] Re: sugar free cookies

My friend found a peanut butter splenda cookie that is on the Foodnetwork.com website from Paula Dean's recipes. This might be of interest to you. It uses only peanut butter, splenda and egg. She said to go a little lite on the splenda tho cause it makes them real sweet.

Jeannine in OK

--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com <mailto:Type-2-Diabetes%40yahoogroups.com> , Keffer Stephanie <binxx80@...> wrote:
>
> hi group,
> So im still in the honeymoon phase of my relationship. :) Were both diabetic and I wanted to surprise him with a tray of cookies. Any suggestions on how to make them without tasting like garbage? I got a bag of splenda here but do just replace the sugar with spelenda? I have yet to make sugar free desserts.
>
> Thanx
> Stephanie
>

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Messages in this topic (1)
5a.

BFO:  carbs, calories, and weight loss :)

Posted by: "Holly Shaltz" holly@shaltzfarm.com   hollyshaltz

Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:03 am (PST)



I know, a lot of you will think I'm pretty slow on
the uptake, and you're probably right :) But I
haven't been anywhere near a normal weight before
in 3 decades, plus I haven't had to count calories
at all in this weight loss process this time. And
I've not seen this whole concept laid out
*anywhere* in all the research I've done in books
and on the internet, just bits and pieces here and
there.

Last couple pieces of the puzzle finally fell into
place last night while I was thinking about all
this diabetes stuff (of course, I *always* think
about diabetes stuff :) I'm thinking out loud
here, and if anyone sees a hole to poke in my
thinking, please feel free. My last 20 pounds of
weight loss may depend upon it <g> Parenthetical
comments there to help clarify for myself and
others where I'm coming from - personal
experience, stuff I've read, things that just fall
into place and make sense, at least to me.

1. T2 diabetes starts with insulin resistance
(IR), which makes the cells resistant to insulin
as a transfer-agent to get glucose from carbs we
eat into the cells for energy.

(And no one really knows what *first* causes IR
except genetics, which may or may not be the whole
story - I'm betting environmental contaminants
have something to do with it as well - the
important thing to remember is it's *not the
diabetic's fault*!)

2. BGs begin to rise due to the IR, and the
pancreas produces more insulin to try to get the
BGs down. This succeeds for a time, maybe a long
time with some, possibly all their lives for those
with a very strong pancreas that's resistant to
glucotoxicity.

3. Insulin is also the fat-storage hormone.
Whatever circulating glucose it can't move into
cells because of IR it will try to remove from the
blood and store as fat. Weight gain, then, may be
the first *sign* of diabetes, not the cause of it
as is so often asserted.

(FWIW, I was much more active than most of my
generation when I started gaining weight - in the
Army and living in Germany where we walked a LOT -
I did a 10k volksmarch when my first child was 3
weeks old, for example, carrying the baby in a
pack - they gave him a gold medal <g> But the
craving for carbs was established during that
period and I never quite managed to lost the 50
pounds I gained that pregnancy, putting on another
50-100 over the next 30 years, in spite of eating
"healthy" by anyone's standards.)

4. Gaining weight makes insulin resistance worse,
which means the pancreas excretes more insulin
(until it burns out), which means we T2s put on
more and more weight, which means IR is worse,
which makes us gain weight....

5. That cycle makes weight loss just about
impossible until the BGs are brought down by
whatever means works for a given person. The
golden triangle of BG management is diet, meds,
and exercise (with not all people needing meds at
all times).

6. Cutting carbs back can make weight loss
possible because there's no longer as much glucose
in the system to be stored as fat. Also, there's
not a lot of free glucose to burn as energy, so
the body "burns" stored fat.

(Even on the ADA diet, many of us can lose weight,
because it might well be a *lot* fewer carbs than
we ate before diagnosis. As the BGs trend
downward, additional cuts in carb consumption help
speed weight loss along.)

7. Exercise is vitally important to that process,
as is adequate protein (I've read a minimum of 10
ounces per day for an average adult - some
authorities say more - I'm guessing it depends on
gender, age, and activity level), to make sure
muscles are *built*, not burned for fuel.
Building muscle tissue may apparently slow down
weight loss (because it's heavier than fat), but
it also helps with IR and helps burn up more
glucose in spite of IR. Seems like I read
someplace that muscles don't need as much insulin
to accept glucose. At any rate, moving large
muscles do use glucose, which also helps bring
down the BGs.

8. Once a balance of *carbs* is achieved, getting
BGs close to or into the non-diabetic range, then
weight loss will continue until a natural balance
of *calories*, exercise, and body size are reached.

(This is where I appear to be at the moment,
hovering just over 140, down from 204 at
diagnosis, when I keep my BGs down with carb control.)

9. If additional weight loss is desired at that
point, then *calories* must be reduced and/or
exercise increased, gradually, for weight loss to
continue (assuming carbs are kept down for
continued BG control).

10. If additional *carbs* are consumed at any
point, raising the BGs, weight gain can result.

(I've personally seen this happen several times in
the last several months - just averaging 30 g of
carbohydrate a day instead of 25 can make me gain
5 pounds practically overnight, even when exercise
stays the same or increases.)

So, for me I would probably have to be willing to
reduce the fat in my diet some more, and increase
my exercise, to continue my weight loss at this
point. I can't realistically cuts carbs further,
and my protein is already down to the minimum 10
ounces. That leaves fat as a source of calories -
butter, cream, fattier meats, etc.

I think increasing exercise sounds more appealing!
<VBG>

To sum up: Maintaining truly normal, non-diabetic
BGs via cutting *carbs* rather than *calories* can
result in weight loss for a T2 diabetic, because
reducing the amount of glucose circulating will
both reduce the amount of insulin needed to handle
it and reduce the amount of glucose available for
storage as fat. Cutting *calories* doesn't work
effectively if the BGs remain out of the
non-diabetic range. Once weight loss ceases due
to normalizing and maintaining normal BGs, then
cutting *calories* and increasing exercise may
help continue weight loss, if desired.

Holly in MI
sharing the obvious so others won't stumble
blindly like I did for so long.... and planning to
send this to my dietician and DNE, on the off
chance they will amend their ADA thinking just a
hair...

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5b.

Re: Follow up Drs. Appt..re steriod-induced-diabetes..

Posted by: "Von K" double07nc@yahoo.com   double07nc

Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:53 am (PST)




I went to my drs. yesterday and told him how the CFE she thought I had steriod-induced-diabtes. He didn't seem to totally agree, even though that was the only thing I had changed/taken in the last 2 mos or so. I told him how my levels had come down tremendously since I had stopped the Advair and just taking the Januemet and how I didn't need any insulin anymore because my levels were low to normal, soemtimes even TOO low. (I was down to 61 one day last week, 2 hrs after breakfast and a snack?) He said that he didn't think taking the Advair was "ENOUGH" of a steriod to push me over the edge to a diabetic state. He said it was "a slight possiblity" but he woudln't totally agree. He told me to continue the Janumet and if that took me "too low" to a hypoglycemic state, to discontinue the night dose. I got back in 6 weeks and he said to continue to diet/exercise/lose weight and there is a chance I could come off all med, but we wouldn't know until the above
happens.
Thanks.
Von

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Messages in this topic (4)
5c.

Re: BFO: carbs, calories, and weight loss :)

Posted by: "Thompson, Cheryl (AHRQ/OCKT)" cheryl.thompson@ahrq.hhs.gov   cherylspeaks

Wed Dec 23, 2009 8:27 am (PST)



Holly, You are awesome. Thanks for sharing that and congratulations.

How long did it take you to lose all of your weight?

I am stuck going in the other direction right now unfortunately and dreading what I will face as I go home for the holiday.

There is always an excessive amount of starchy food at the table. Mac and Cheese, Yams, Potatoes, Corn... Bread and Sweet deserts.

This summer I rode my bike like a fiend, felt incredible, but failed to lose the weight that you would think I would given the amount of time and dedication (every morning before work and on the weekends even longer rides).

I need to snap out of the cycle I'm in right now, but it is cold and comfort foods are so.... Comforting :-)

Any advice?

Cheryl in DC

________________________________

From: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Holly Shaltz
Sent: Wednesday, December 23, 2009 8:49 AM
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Type-2-Diabetes] BFO: carbs, calories, and weight loss :)

I know, a lot of you will think I'm pretty slow on
the uptake, and you're probably right :) But I
haven't been anywhere near a normal weight before
in 3 decades, plus I haven't had to count calories
at all in this weight loss process this time. And
I've not seen this whole concept laid out
*anywhere* in all the research I've done in books
and on the internet, just bits and pieces here and
there.

Last couple pieces of the puzzle finally fell into
place last night while I was thinking about all
this diabetes stuff (of course, I *always* think
about diabetes stuff :) I'm thinking out loud
here, and if anyone sees a hole to poke in my
thinking, please feel free. My last 20 pounds of
weight loss may depend upon it <g> Parenthetical
comments there to help clarify for myself and
others where I'm coming from - personal
experience, stuff I've read, things that just fall
into place and make sense, at least to me.

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Messages in this topic (4)
5d.

Re: BFO: carbs, calories, and weight loss :)

Posted by: "Holly Shaltz" holly@shaltzfarm.com   hollyshaltz

Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:09 am (PST)



Cheryl writes:

<<How long did it take you to lose all of your
weight?>>

About a year, maybe 13 months - about 5 pounds a
month on average, with the occasional month where
I gained a pound before losing again. Been
maintaining 140-145 for about 3 months now. I
won't worry about whether I want to lose more
until next month.

<<There is always an excessive amount of starchy
food at the table. Mac and Cheese, Yams, Potatoes,
Corn... Bread and Sweet deserts.>>

No one can make you eat any of that :) But if you
feel you're going to anyway, maybe you can plan
ahead of time to eat the smallest possible serving
of a couple things, and leave the rest totally
untasted? Don't go hungry, though - eat enough
protein and salad and other low-carb stuff so you
don't get hungry. At Thanksgiving, I had one
small spoonful (dessert spoon) of my daughter's
homemade cranberry sauce, and the same amount of
dressing. The rest was easy to avoid, having
given myself permission to eat tiny amounts of the
two things I most liked.

As for dessert - can you make and take, or make
something there, that's very low carb and
reasonable for you to eat? The pumpkin pudding is
great, if you love pumpkin pie - 1/2 c of canned
plain pumpkin, 1 egg, artificial sweeteners and
spices to taste. Zap in the microwave til set,
and enjoy! About 7 g of carb, but it counts as a
veggie as well as a dessert, so you don't have to
eat as many veggies with the meal, to help keep
the overall carb count down.

<<but failed to lose the weight that you would
think I would given the amount of time and
dedication >>

Exercise and calorie-counting won't do much unless
you get your BGs down - are you checking those
regularly so you know what you're dealing with? I
find it a great motivator :) The exercise remains
important, even if you're not losing weight - it
will help control the BGs and keep up your muscle
mass/build up your muscles if needed.

<<I need to snap out of the cycle I'm in right
now, but it is cold and comfort foods are so....
Comforting :-)>>

It's a hard time of year for anyone used to
celebrating these holidays with food :) Practical
things *I* do that help *me*:

I did my best to save up test strips so I could be
testing more often, to help keep myself on track,
and I will keep weighing and measuring everything
I eat, and writing it down, even if it's
embarrassing. The cookies I got at the exchange
are finally eaten (*mostly* by DH and DD :) and no
more will be made this year. Somehow it's easier
for me to avoid eating pie, so DD will make a pie
for the two of them to enjoy.

I'll keep up my exercising, even if I don't want
to, because I know afterwards I feel better, it
helps keep me motivated to be careful of my BGs,
and it helps keep down cravings.

If I need to, I will enlist the help of DD and DH
- I've done that in the past. I just tell them to
put away a given food, or hide it, or eat it up,
or whatever is easiest, to get it out of my sight.
There's no shame in asking for that kind of help!

I drink a lot of tea - keeps my mouth busy with
something that won't affect my BGs. Also, believe
it or not, brushing your teeth as soon as your
allowed food is eaten, really does help. And I
avoid triggers - like, onion flavors, for me,
trigger a craving for chocolate that hangs in
there even after brushing the teeth :)

I don't know if any of these things might help you
- you'll have to figure out what works for you -
but maybe some of these strategies might help
spark some ideas for you.

Finally, I think it's important to not let
anything become a guilt trip. One of the biggest
surprises to me, after years of craving what I
wasn't "supposed" to eat and feeling horribly
guilty about both cravings and giving in, is that
if I eat to my BGs, no guilt is involved. If I
eat something that spikes my BG, I take it as a
lesson learned (and it frequently needs to be
learned more than once! :) and don't kick myself
about it. I'm not sure what the psychology of it
is, but somehow lack of guilt make me more free to
choose wisely.

If you still have access to email while home, do
write to the list to vent how you feel, or
celebrate your self-control, or anything in
between :) It helps to have a place where people
really do understand what you're going through.

Holly in MI

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6.

Carb Counting Books

Posted by: "Tina Ronald" tronald@wildblue.net   countrygal34mi

Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:53 am (PST)



I am looking around and want to know what book you all use? ADA has a few. One is called what do I eat now? I would like one to take with me when I am running around and one for home use for basics. Thank you Tina in MI

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7a.

New Intro Tina in MI

Posted by: "Tina Ronald" tronald@wildblue.net   countrygal34mi

Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:53 am (PST)



I kind of jumped onto another post the other day and thought I would share my diabetic story. I am 43 from Howell MI. My father is diabetic and G-ma. 19 years ago I was diagnosed with Ulcerative Colitis. They put me on Prednisone and my blood sugar jumped to 500 and would fluctuate according to the amount of Pred I was on. They put me on humulin sliding scale while this was going on. When I went off Pred the blood levels would return to normal and I would go off humilin.

About 10 years ago same thing happened. Back on Predinisone back on Humulin and when I went off of the steroid this time I stayed a Type 2 Diabetic. Several DRs have changed my meds around. I was on pills, insulin, Lantis,Byetta, metformin,advandia. BG was all controlled and fine. Well 2 weeks before Thanksgiving I was having flu symptoms, Vomitting, diarrhea, dehydration etc. Went to my Dr he sent me down for bloodwork to check my levels. He scheduled a CT scan because I was having confusion issues. I never made it to the CT scheduled for 2 days later because I had to call an ambulance because I was dying. I could not catch my breath or walk. I didn't know who I was. So they admitted me because I had an infection throughout my whole body from my colitis and My BG was over 600 from the infection. I was in CCU for 7 days for DKA and complications from my colitis. I have found a new DR and my sugars are still high from the Pred. It runs from 170- 450 daily. I am on 50 units Lantis at bedtime and Novalog sliding scale with meals. I am going to a diabetic class in Jan to learn to eat better and learn about Carb counting. I can't do that type of management until I go off the Pred in 2 months but I want to learn everything I can. My new Dr mentioned it so I started researching it on the net and found this list. So that's my tail lol Tina in MI

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7b.

Re: New Intro Tina in MI

Posted by: "Holly Shaltz" holly@shaltzfarm.com   hollyshaltz

Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:16 am (PST)



Wow, Tina, thanks for sharing your story - it's a
good reminder to all of us about the dangers of
ketoacidosis. I had to look it up again to remind
myself, when you posted "DKA" last time, and it's
scary to see *all* the symptoms that attend DKA
listed in your post! I'm so glad you were able to
call an ambulance!

I don't know much about Ulcerative Colitis (wiki'd
it just now - glad I don't have it!). Is there
any treatment you can try that doesn't involve
steroids?

Glad you're hear to share your story with us!

Holly in MI

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8a.

Re: How do I know if I am eating the right foods? - Holly in MI :)

Posted by: "Wee K Chew" wee@weekhiong.plus.com   wee_khiong

Wed Dec 23, 2009 10:19 am (PST)



Holly,

"Test before you eat, and frequently afterwards, to figure out what spikes your BGs and what doesn't :)"

All foods spikes the BG anyway :(
How do I tell which foods works for me?
I have not come across a single food that does not spike the BG.

Kind Regards,
Wee
a recently diagnosed T2 in UK :)

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8b.

Re: How do I know if I am eating the right foods? - Holly in MI :)

Posted by: "Holly Shaltz" holly@shaltzfarm.com   hollyshaltz

Wed Dec 23, 2009 11:22 am (PST)



Wee writes:

<<All foods spikes the BG anyway :(
How do I tell which foods works for me?
I have not come across a single food that does not
spike the BG.>>

When I first started, my BGs were quite high - my
A1C was 11.1, and my first BG test on my meter was
454. Detecting spikes in circumstances like that
is difficult :) Is something like that what
you're dealing with?

But as I learned something about how to eat - the
ADA (American Diabetes Association) diet started
me off a couple weeks after diagnosis - and the
carbs I was eating started to come down, and the
meds I was taking started to kick in, and I began
to see my BGs trending downward, then I began to
be able to see what specific foods and exercise
did to my BGs.

Keep in mind reasonable amounts of protein and fat
will *not* spike your BGs. Carbs will.
Too-strenuous exercise can also spike your BG,
which means start slow (but do start!) and work
your way up. And illness can spike your BGs. But
most of the time it's those wonderful, luscious
carbs - the very food many of us craved before
diagnosis - that does a number on the BGs.

For starters, try testing just before you eat,
then again at 1 hour and 2 hours afterwards.
Write it down, along with what you ate (weighed
and measured for best information and analysis).
You will soon begin to see patterns - eating more
carbs will result in higher BGs; eating fewer
will, over time, result in lower BGs.

Also, test your BG before exercise and immediately
afterwards. That's *great* motivation to exercise
again :) Even a mild walk can have a big impact.

When you get your BG down to near-normal levels,
spikes will be *very* obvious :) Then you can
decide how much fluctuation you want to allow in
your BGs - in general the less the better, but
it's a personal choice - and begin to "eat to your
meter".

I don't know how many test strips you get in the
UK under your health care system - I would
strongly recommend you do whatever you have to so
you can have 10 a day if at all possible. The
more tests you take early on, the sooner you will
see positive results, learn what *your* body can
handle in the way of carbs, lose weight, see your
A1C go down, and just plain feel better all the
way around. When you've pretty much figured out
what you can safely eat, then you can drop your
testing back quite a bit.

Many days now I test only fasting when I get up,
and bedtime. Only if I identify a problem I need
to work on do I test more - whether that problem
is Christmas goodies <g>, or managing my BG during
exercise, or adding a new food to my eating, or
suspected illness, or.... Well, OK, there's nearly
always some sort of problem :) Every time I find
myself feeling like I've figured this thing out,
WHAM, something new pops up, or I realize I've
forgotten a basic thing I had learned months
earlier - like I have to exercise to keep my BGs
from creeping up over a period of days.

I hope this addresses your issue :) It's hard
getting started with diabetes self-management,
especially at this time of year. Lots of people
told me to be patient when i was first dx'd.
Patience is good, if it's backed up with facing
those BG tests and writing everything down. It
pays off with problems solved - or at least
nibbled away at :)

Holly in MI

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8c.

What are "spikes"? - Holly in MI :)

Posted by: "Wee K Chew" wee@weekhiong.plus.com   wee_khiong

Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:00 pm (PST)




> When I first started, my BGs were quite high - my
> A1C was 11.1, and my first BG test on my meter was
> 454. Detecting spikes in circumstances like that
> is difficult :) Is something like that what
> you're dealing with?

This am, I had a hypo and BG was 2.4mmol/L.
I felt "disoriented" but managed to eat a bowl of egg noodle, hands shaking :(
After 15 minutes recovery, BG was 14.8mmol/L.
Is this what you called a "spike"?
After 1hr, it goes down to 9.1mmol/L.
After 2hrs, 6.5mmol/L.
After 3hrs, 5.4mmol/L.

> But as I learned something about how to eat - the
> ADA (American Diabetes Association) diet started
> me off a couple weeks after diagnosis - and the
> carbs I was eating started to come down, and the
> meds I was taking started to kick in, and I began
> to see my BGs trending downward, then I began to
> be able to see what specific foods and exercise
> did to my BGs.

Like you, I have been following a low carb diet, paying attention to portion size.
And yes, I agree, my BG is now a lot better :)

> Keep in mind reasonable amounts of protein and fat
> will *not* spike your BGs. Carbs will.
> Too-strenuous exercise can also spike your BG,
> which means start slow (but do start!) and work
> your way up. And illness can spike your BGs. But
> most of the time it's those wonderful, luscious
> carbs - the very food many of us craved before
> diagnosis - that does a number on the BGs.

I don't do strenuous exercise.
I walk up the stairs and plenty of walking daily :)
I have plenty of physical exercise, blessed with nature of job :)

> For starters, try testing just before you eat,
> then again at 1 hour and 2 hours afterwards.
> Write it down, along with what you ate (weighed
> and measured for best information and analysis).
> You will soon begin to see patterns - eating more
> carbs will result in higher BGs; eating fewer
> will, over time, result in lower BGs.

Yes, I record my BG b4 & 1hr, 2hr after food daily :)

> Also, test your BG before exercise and immediately
> afterwards. That's *great* motivation to exercise
> again :) Even a mild walk can have a big impact.
I must record my BG b4 & after excercise, good idea too :)
> When you get your BG down to near-normal levels,
> spikes will be *very* obvious :) Then you can
> decide how much fluctuation you want to allow in
> your BGs - in general the less the better, but
> it's a personal choice - and begin to "eat to your
> meter".

I am not ready for this until I understand the meaning of "spikes".
Not sure what you mean by "spikes" :(

> I don't know how many test strips you get in the
> UK under your health care system -

My doctor says he will let me have strips for *only* 6 months :(
After 6 months, that will stop :(

I would strongly recommend you do whatever you have to so
> you can have 10 a day if at all possible. The
> more tests you take early on, the sooner you will
> see positive results, learn what *your* body can
> handle in the way of carbs, lose weight, see your
> A1C go down, and just plain feel better all the
> way around. When you've pretty much figured out
> what you can safely eat, then you can drop your
> testing back quite a bit.
I am already on this case :)
> Many days now I test only fasting when I get up,
> and bedtime. Only if I identify a problem I need
> to work on do I test more - whether that problem
> is Christmas goodies <g>, or managing my BG during
> exercise, or adding a new food to my eating, or
> suspected illness, or.... Well, OK, there's nearly
> always some sort of problem :) Every time I find
> myself feeling like I've figured this thing out,
> WHAM, something new pops up, or I realize I've
> forgotten a basic thing I had learned months
> earlier - like I have to exercise to keep my BGs
> from creeping up over a period of days.
I am the same, I am sure you are not alone in this respect :)
> I hope this addresses your issue :) It's hard
> getting started with diabetes self-management,
> especially at this time of year. Lots of people
> told me to be patient when i was first dx'd.
> Patience is good, if it's backed up with facing
> those BG tests and writing everything down. It
> pays off with problems solved - or at least
> nibbled away at :)

My issue is I *still don't know* what "spike" means :)

Wee in Middx, UK :)


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9a.

Metformin and Lows

Posted by: "Tricia" psimmons1219@gmail.com   psimmons1219

Wed Dec 23, 2009 6:01 pm (PST)



While we have been talking about my DIL I saw some of you say I could not have lows from my metformin. I have recently had a 38, a 42, a 49, and lots of 50s and 60s before lowering my dose. So far I have not had anything lower than 83 since I changed my dosage but I am only a few days into the change. My dose has not changed since I was diagnosed and I have lost around 45 pounds since January. (Almost 100 all together)

My activity had increased dramatically recently. I am just starting to get out of the wheel chair after about 2 years. I know my pain level can affect my glucose level (it can go up or down) but I never thought it could cause such severe lows. Is it even possible that my pain level can change my glucose to that extent? I have seen stress cause me to spike a 400 glucose once but I was severely upset when that happened and that was when I was first diagnosed in January of the year. Since being on medication I think my highest numbers have been in the 170s and those are extremely rare.

As far as my DIL she has not been officially diagnosed. I have suspected she was having highs because of her mood, and her increased thirst along with other things. I checked her glucose and it was around 140 mg/dl. I gave her a meter and all the supplies. We went through all the information together about the meter and she learned how to use it. She has not had any values under 95 and has had several 120s, 130s and 140s. Nothing higher than the 140s. I refuse to be the nagging mother in law and will give just as much support as my son and DIL want from me but I will not but in to there lives.

Holly,
I know when I say I am obsessive about my glucose it may make people think I am a touch neurotic but I am can not think of a better word.
The friend of yours with the fasting 125... Will she consider seeing your doctor or does she have the "ignorance is bliss" attitude?

<<And exercise, right? <g> >>
I am not use to thinking of real exercise. I have used an exercise band for years but I have never considered it really exercising. I am working around the house for the first time in several years and even though the pain is sometimes intolerable I am starting to feel much more my old self. It is kinda like I have been in a waking coma for the last several years. I was on lots of medicine and the weight was just pulling me down.

Jude
What is PCOS? It will probably be obvious when I see it but I can not figure it out. LOL
I thought being glucose intolerant was diabetic???
I really think being given a "real" diagnosis of diabetes is better than beating around the bush and confusing the issues. I actually feel sorry for people that do not have straight forward doctors. I think my doctor tried to pull that on me one time. He thought he would lesson the impact of something he was telling me and I told him not to play word games with me. It is almost like lying in my opinion when a doctor does not give you all the information.

Kristy
DIL is not pregnant. I have a 1 year old grandbaby. She did not have a GTT when pregnant and I think she should have. The baby was around 9 pounds when born. I do worry about what she eats but not to the point I let it affect me. I can not afford to allow people to upset me. It will set of my Crohn's disease and I will end up in the hospital. I have learned better!

Thanks to all of you that are talking to me.
Merry Christmas
Tricia

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9b.

Re: Metformin and Lows

Posted by: "Jude" peridotjude@yahoo.com   peridotjude

Wed Dec 23, 2009 8:49 pm (PST)



--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups.com, "Tricia" <psimmons1219@...> wrote:I have recently had a 38, a 42, a 49, and lots of 50s and 60s before lowering my dose. So far I have not had anything lower than 83 since I changed my dosage but I am only a few days into the change>>

Years ago, I did a liquid fast diet (Optifast), about 500 calories a day of high protein shakes and *nothing* else but no-calorie liquids, and no diabetic meds from the first day of the diet. I soon found out that my normal glucose range was between about 75-95; as long as I stayed on that diet, I never saw anything lower or higher.

But anyway, my point is this-- either the metformin is causing those 38s and numbers in the 40s, or you are actually hypoglycemic as well as diabetic (this can happen, especially in the early months and years after diagnosis, when the pancreas can sometimes overcompensate and release too much insulin and other times not supply enough.) Whatever, I would *certainly* ask my doctor (I might even think about telling, not asking) to discontinue the stupid metformin-- with a 5.3 A1c and these kinds of lows, you certainly do not need it, IMO. I'm not a medical professional, so don't substitute my judgment for your own, and don't discontinue the metformin without asking or informing him, but do check with your doc; I just can't figure out why you're still on metformin.

<<<I have lost around 45 pounds since January. (Almost 100 all together)My activity had increased dramatically recently. I am just starting to get out of the wheel chair after about 2 years>>

Which is wonderful-- losing weight and increasing exercise are certainly two big kingpins of bringing the glucose level into control.

<snip> I am working around the house for the first time in several years and even though the pain is sometimes intolerable I am starting to feel much more my old self. It is kinda like I have been in a waking coma for the last several years. I was on lots of medicine and the weight was just pulling me down>>>

My God, it's a miracle! I'm ecstatic for you! How wonderful... I haven't heard such a happy story in years. Thank God (the universe, whatever) for healing and renewal.

> Jude What is PCOS? It will probably be obvious when I see it but I can not figure it out>>

Polycystic ovary disease. Go ahead and google it if you want to know more.It can be a part of something called metabolic syndrome (google that too!) which is a set of problems that can include PCOS (females only, obviously), high blood pressure, glucose intolerance, a high degree of inflammation, excess abdominal fat, etc.

<<I thought being glucose intolerant was diabetic???>>

Yep. Glucose intolerance or insulin resistance are synonymous with type two diabetes.

> I really think being given a "real" diagnosis of diabetes is better than beating around the bush and confusing the issues>>

Well, when a doc tells someone they have metabolic syndrome, it's not incorrect per se for him to tell her she has glucose tolerance problems and for her to lose weight, exercise, stop eating refined sugar and HFCS,etc, the typical advice. But I think it's too bad for the patient not to realize what glucose intolerance actually is-- after all, diabetes is a name/label that people sort of understand. I dunno. Even docs have to do what they have to do, I guess, right? Right.

Judy D.

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