Messages In This Digest (25 Messages)
- 1a.
- Re: Statin Drugs From: Diane Moro
- 2a.
- Re: seeing an endo From: Diane Moro
- 2b.
- Re: seeing an endo From: Cindi Marshall
- 3.1.
- Re: rant about BG swings From: Diane Moro
- 4a.
- Strange Low From: AnaLog Services, Inc.
- 4b.
- Re: Strange Low From: Jude
- 4c.
- Re: Strange Low From: AnaLog Services, Inc.
- 4d.
- Re: Strange Low From: Dorothy Wurth
- 4e.
- Re: Strange Low From: AnaLog Services, Inc.
- 5a.
- Metformin Overdose From: brian cooper
- 5b.
- Re: Metformin Overdose From: ron42nm
- 5c.
- Re: Metformin Overdose From: Jude
- 5d.
- Re: Metformin Overdose From: AnaLog Services, Inc.
- 5e.
- Re: Metformin Overdose From: Dorothy Wurth
- 5f.
- Re: Metformin Overdose From: ron42nm
- 6.1.
- Re: rant about BG swings - Holly :) From: Wee K Chew
- 7.1.
- Holly - rant about BG swings From: barbhealth2008
- 8.1.
- Rant about BG swings brings positive feedback from lurker to Holly From: Michael Garmaise
- 9.1.
- Diane - Re: glucose reading ups and down Q. Insulin? From: barbhealth2008
- 10.1.
- Tiamat- beefalos Re: rant about BG swings From: barbhealth2008
- 11.1.
- Holly-another thought - Re: rant about BG swings From: barbhealth2008
- 12.
- Holly's rant From: Dorothy Wurth
- 13a.
- Re: Statin Drugs/hair falling out? From: Katherine Walker
- 13b.
- Re: Statin Drugs/hair falling out? From: Amal
- 14.
- year-end report From: Holly Shaltz
Messages
- 1a.
-
Re: Statin Drugs
Posted by: "Diane Moro" deemoro@gmail.com signoradiana
Fri Jan 1, 2010 4:11 am (PST)
My husband won't take them either, he had a very bad reaction to them, and
the coq10 gave him headaches.
Sometimes we just have to know that drugs won't cure everything.
~diane
On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 11:32 AM, Amal <amal_mba10@yahoo.com > wrote:
>
>
>
>
> --- On *Thu, 12/31/09, Barb T <barb1024@yahoo.com >* wrote:
>
> Syd said "I refuse to take the statins, and my diagnosis is very similar to
> yours, The blunt reality is that high cholesterol is the least of our
> worries, and risking the side effects of the statins is a bad gamble as far
> as I am concerned."
>
> ******************I also refused to take statins. I am not trying to
> discourage others from using these drugs. This is my choice only based on
> my own preference. This issue was discussed at length with my endo but he
> was not able to convince me to take them. Those on statins have to take
> COQ1o as the drugs deplete the body of this vital nutrient. Others may
> think I am foolish not to take statins being border line high but to me it
> is better to get a heart attack and die than see my hair falling off like
> one of my friends (i.e, if high cholesterol is the culprit in the first
> place!). My quality of life is more important than anything else. But that
> is just me!!
>
> Amal
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
- 2a.
-
Re: seeing an endo
Posted by: "Diane Moro" deemoro@gmail.com signoradiana
Fri Jan 1, 2010 4:17 am (PST)
That's what I was thinking also, I don't need to add another doc to the list
of appointments I already have, and if at some point I see I'm having
trouble controlling my bg without diet, I'll see what to do.
~diane
On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 9:38 PM, Jude <peridotjude@yahoo.com > wrote:
>
> FWIW, one cent marked down from two, I agree. What is an endo going to do
> for you? He'll see your 5.8 and agree that "gee, you're doing just fine, so
> go home, keep on doing what you're doing, and I'll see you again in 4-6
> months for another panel of blood work and a check up. Till then, go have a
> good life."
>
> Which would not be bad advice, IMO... I don't know about you guys, but I'm
> paying about as much attention to my $*#@*?~ diabetes as I'm willing to at
> the present time.
>
> Judy D.
>
>
>
- 2b.
-
Re: seeing an endo
Posted by: "Cindi Marshall" cjmobxnc@embarqmail.com cindimarshall196327909
Fri Jan 1, 2010 6:20 am (PST)
Good morning, Holly, and Happy New Year to you!
I just read your post about your upcoming endo appointment, and am wondering if maybe they might want to get to see you in person and learn about you and your personal situation before they say anything about your diabetic goals, both long-term and short term. I just had my first meeting with the CDE at our local health department and that is what they do. It was a very interesting and productive meeting.
Hope that 2010 is your best year yet,
Cindi
From: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. [mailto:Type-2-Diabetes@com yahoogroups. ] On Behalf Of Holly Shaltzcom
Sent: Thursday, December 31, 2009 7:42 PM
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
Subject: Re: [Type-2-Diabetes] Re: seeing an endo
I finally got the endo's paperwork, and have
filled it out. A pretty standard medical history,
and two separate sheets on which to list what I
typically eat. Nothing asking for my current A1C,
but I suppose they'll probably do a new one with
their own lab. Nothing asking for my
BG/A1C/diabetes management goals. I suppose
they're not used to diabetics having their own
goals :)
<http://geo.yahoo.com/serv? >s=97359714/ grpId=2106423/ grpspId=17050616 62/msgId= 48267/stime= 1262306474/ nc1=5741391/ nc2=5658258/ nc3=5689707
- 3.1.
-
Re: rant about BG swings
Posted by: "Diane Moro" deemoro@gmail.com signoradiana
Fri Jan 1, 2010 4:30 am (PST)
To thine own self be true....this is my New Year's phrase.
When I was diagnosed with diabetes, I had to learn to get back into taking
care of me.
My boundaries have been all over the place, taking care of grandkids, kids,
even a full grown husband!
Feedback is great, strokes are nice too, but in the end, we are each alone
with our own bodies.
Take good care!
~diane
On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 7:51 PM, Holly Shaltz <holly@shaltzfarm.com > wrote:
> My thanks to all who responded in a kind way to my
> rant - which, so far, is everyone who responded! :)
>
>
- 4a.
-
Strange Low
Posted by: "AnaLog Services, Inc." analog@logwell.com sydlevine
Fri Jan 1, 2010 6:18 am (PST)
I had quite a few carbs for "brunch" yesterday. I shot according to my regular formula. The sig other has a hopefully temporary eye problem, so I have been recruited as the designated driver of late (usually she does all the driving). Anyway, we made a quickie run to a nearby town for prescription drugs and a few groceries. I did not even take my kit because we were only going to be gone briefly. Anyway, we are in the little country grocery, and I start feeling like hell. When I started sweating, I suspected a fairly profound low. No glucose tabs in the pocket, so the sig other got a snickers bar. Those damn things have 30 grams of sugar in em, and of course I had to eat the entire dern thing (first one I have had in close to ten years). That did the trick, and I began feeling better in short order. I figured I badly overcorrected, and was expecting to have to do something about it when I got home. Lo and behold, I never got above 125 by the time I tested a couple of hours later (post prandial spikes are normally long in duration for me even with insulin, so this was not normal).
This has happened to me twice now, and both times there was a proper calculated insulin dose with the number of carbs eaten prior to the episode. Is this just "one of those things" that happens, or is there a rational explanation? Might this be caused by accidentally hitting a capillary? You can't tell about that with pen delivery systems.
Anyway, I was just curious if anybody has this happen, and if there is a likely reason for it.
TIA
Syd - 4b.
-
Re: Strange Low
Posted by: "Jude" peridotjude@yahoo.com peridotjude
Fri Jan 1, 2010 10:19 am (PST)
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , "AnaLog Services, Inc." <analog@...> wrote: I had quite a few carbs for "brunch" yesterday. I shot according to my regular formula. <snip> I start feeling like hell. When I started sweating, I suspected a fairly profound low <snip> Lo and behold, I never got above 125 by the time I tested a couple of hours later <snip> Is this just "one of those things" that happens, or is there a rational explanation? Might this be caused by accidentally hitting a capillary?>>com
First of all, I think there's always an explanation for a low or a high. We might not be able to figure out what in heck it is, but in my experience, there's always been a reason why I see what I see on my meter.
Sometimes even a little bit of extra exercise/activity can make us need less insulin-- were you doing a lot of walking around the store, and had you walked prior to that, either at home, in and out of the car, etc? We don't think of shopping as exercise, but it certainly is, and it can profoundly affect someone who is normally more sedentary.
Have you lost weight since your insulin to carb ratio and correction factor were figured? If so, maybe your insulin needs have changed-- even a slight change, given the right circumstances, can result in a low.
Hitting a capillary? No. I imagine those who take 4-6 injections a day are probably "hitting" one or piercing one all the live long day! As long as the injection is into subcutaneous fat, this is not an issue, AFAIK.
You're fortunate to be hypo-aware, and that you were near a source of food/drink to correct. You probably did over-correct, but OTOH, because you undoubtedly were down below 60 to feel that yucky, I think seeing a 125 a while later sounds about right. With no meter to check, who knows what your starting low number was? I mean, it could have been 47 or something!
And finally, it is what it is. Diabetes is a weird-ass condition that sometimes seems to take the bit in its teeth and runs. Since we're not capable of eating exactly the same foods in the same portions at the same time every day (no one could, even if they wanted to), and every day brings new stresses, different amounts of exercise, etc, it's no wonder that our insulin needs aren't set in stone.
Judy D.
- 4c.
-
Re: Strange Low
Posted by: "AnaLog Services, Inc." analog@logwell.com sydlevine
Fri Jan 1, 2010 11:52 am (PST)
None of those possibilities apply. I normally have a soft response curve. Heck, one night I grabbed the Humalog pen and shot 55 units instead of Lantus. Had not eaten anything for awhile and went to bed not realizing my stupid mistake, I woke up mildly low, but wound up overcorrecting with just 16 grams of glucose.
The deal yesterday could only have been a few units too many, if any at all. But it hit me like a ton of bricks, like it did that one other time. And 30 grams (over a friggin'' ounce) of sugar did not overcorrect.
I understand the "what it is is what it is", but my engineers mind always looks for a rational explanation for such things.
I am a novice at insulin injections, and have only used a pen (except for that week in the hospital). I was under the impression that you guys that used syringes aspirated a tiny amount of fluid to make sure you were not in a capillary or other vessel. Is that not true? It was my understanding that was really a bad thing, but I get that from the internet, so...
Syd
----- Original Message -----
From: Jude
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Friday, January 01, 2010 1:19 PM
Subject: [Type-2-Diabetes] Re: Strange Low
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , "AnaLog Services, Inc." <analog@...> wrote: I had quite a few carbs for "brunch" yesterday. I shot according to my regular formula. <snip> I start feeling like hell. When I started sweating, I suspected a fairly profound low <snip> Lo and behold, I never got above 125 by the time I tested a couple of hours later <snip> Is this just "one of those things" that happens, or is there a rational explanation? Might this be caused by accidentally hitting a capillary?>>com
First of all, I think there's always an explanation for a low or a high. We might not be able to figure out what in heck it is, but in my experience, there's always been a reason why I see what I see on my meter.
Sometimes even a little bit of extra exercise/activity can make us need less insulin-- were you doing a lot of walking around the store, and had you walked prior to that, either at home, in and out of the car, etc? We don't think of shopping as exercise, but it certainly is, and it can profoundly affect someone who is normally more sedentary.
Have you lost weight since your insulin to carb ratio and correction factor were figured? If so, maybe your insulin needs have changed-- even a slight change, given the right circumstances, can result in a low.
Hitting a capillary? No. I imagine those who take 4-6 injections a day are probably "hitting" one or piercing one all the live long day! As long as the injection is into subcutaneous fat, this is not an issue, AFAIK.
You're fortunate to be hypo-aware, and that you were near a source of food/drink to correct. You probably did over-correct, but OTOH, because you undoubtedly were down below 60 to feel that yucky, I think seeing a 125 a while later sounds about right. With no meter to check, who knows what your starting low number was? I mean, it could have been 47 or something!
And finally, it is what it is. Diabetes is a weird-ass condition that sometimes seems to take the bit in its teeth and runs. Since we're not capable of eating exactly the same foods in the same portions at the same time every day (no one could, even if they wanted to), and every day brings new stresses, different amounts of exercise, etc, it's no wonder that our insulin needs aren't set in stone.
Judy D.
- 4d.
-
Re: Strange Low
Posted by: "Dorothy Wurth" dottie.wurth@yahoo.com dottie.wurth
Fri Jan 1, 2010 1:12 pm (PST)
Hi Syd,
When I first started with the Lantus, I was terrified that I would inject into a capillary and cause problems. My first career was in dentistry, and I always had to aspirate before giving an injection to make sure I wasn't injecting directly into the blood system. My doctor actually laughed at my concern and told me that it was nothing to worry about with the Lantus injection into fatty tissue. I don't even try to aspirate using the syringe. I can't tell you the number of times that the injection site has bled due to hitting a capillary. The only problem is staining my clothes. Your mistake with the Humulog and Lantus is one of my fears. I have caught myself almost doing that once. It's good to hear that it didn't cause terrible consequences. Back to the cause of this problem I wonder if it could be related to your heart and stress. Take good care.
Dottie
--- On Fri, 1/1/10, AnaLog Services, Inc. <analog@logwell.com > wrote:
From: AnaLog Services, Inc. <analog@logwell.com >
Subject: Re: [Type-2-Diabetes] Re: Strange Low
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 11:49 AM
None of those possibilities apply. I normally have a soft response curve. Heck, one night I grabbed the Humalog pen and shot 55 units instead of Lantus. Had not eaten anything for awhile and went to bed not realizing my stupid mistake, I woke up mildly low, but wound up overcorrecting with just 16 grams of glucose.
The deal yesterday could only have been a few units too many, if any at all. But it hit me like a ton of bricks, like it did that one other time. And 30 grams (over a friggin'' ounce) of sugar did not overcorrect.
I understand the "what it is is what it is", but my engineers mind always looks for a rational explanation for such things.
I am a novice at insulin injections, and have only used a pen (except for that week in the hospital). I was under the impression that you guys that used syringes aspirated a tiny amount of fluid to make sure you were not in a capillary or other vessel. Is that not true? It was my understanding that was really a bad thing, but I get that from the internet, so...
Syd
- 4e.
-
Re: Strange Low
Posted by: "AnaLog Services, Inc." analog@logwell.com sydlevine
Fri Jan 1, 2010 2:16 pm (PST)
No heart problems at present, and no particular stress.
I have almost done that mixing up the Lantus and Humalog a couple of times, but only once have I actually done it. I keep the pens in different locations, but still managed to absent mindedly pick up the wrong one. One really does need to think about these things and not rely on the "autopilot".
Judy might be right about a bit of extra exercise yesterday, but it has never caused a problem before. I spose it will remain one of those mysteries of life. I have never liked those.
I read some posts on a board someplace where long time insulin users were critical of the pen delivery systems since you could not aspirate to check where you were. That has stuck in the back of my mind for years since all I have ever used are pens (first Byetta, now Lantus and Humalog, and soon Symlin).
Thanks.
Syd
Syd
----- Original Message -----
From: Dorothy Wurth
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Friday, January 01, 2010 3:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Type-2-Diabetes] Re: Strange Low
Hi Syd,
When I first started with the Lantus, I was terrified that I would inject into a capillary and cause problems. My first career was in dentistry, and I always had to aspirate before giving an injection to make sure I wasn't injecting directly into the blood system. My doctor actually laughed at my concern and told me that it was nothing to worry about with the Lantus injection into fatty tissue. I don't even try to aspirate using the syringe. I can't tell you the number of times that the injection site has bled due to hitting a capillary. The only problem is staining my clothes. Your mistake with the Humulog and Lantus is one of my fears. I have caught myself almost doing that once. It's good to hear that it didn't cause terrible consequences. Back to the cause of this problem I wonder if it could be related to your heart and stress. Take good care.
Dottie
--- On Fri, 1/1/10, AnaLog Services, Inc. <analog@logwell.com > wrote:
From: AnaLog Services, Inc. <analog@logwell.com >
Subject: Re: [Type-2-Diabetes] Re: Strange Low
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
Date: Friday, January 1, 2010, 11:49 AM
None of those possibilities apply. I normally have a soft response curve. Heck, one night I grabbed the Humalog pen and shot 55 units instead of Lantus. Had not eaten anything for awhile and went to bed not realizing my stupid mistake, I woke up mildly low, but wound up overcorrecting with just 16 grams of glucose.
The deal yesterday could only have been a few units too many, if any at all. But it hit me like a ton of bricks, like it did that one other time. And 30 grams (over a friggin'' ounce) of sugar did not overcorrect.
I understand the "what it is is what it is", but my engineers mind always looks for a rational explanation for such things.
I am a novice at insulin injections, and have only used a pen (except for that week in the hospital). I was under the impression that you guys that used syringes aspirated a tiny amount of fluid to make sure you were not in a capillary or other vessel. Is that not true? It was my understanding that was really a bad thing, but I get that from the internet, so...
Syd
- 5a.
-
Metformin Overdose
Posted by: "brian cooper" brianevans_99@yahoo.com brianevans_99
Fri Jan 1, 2010 6:20 am (PST)
Syd, Jude & Others,
Sorry I couldn't thank you sooner for your suggestions about dealing with this upsetting and unsettling SNAFU.
Short of hiring a lawyer, which I can't afford, I have real doubts about what I can do alone. Don't you think that whichever party is responsible--med school or pharmacy, professional or staffer--will point the finger elsewhere, and try to alter their records? Are they really going to admit to me that they were responsible? Even if they were ethical enough to do so personally, the organizations they work in doubtless have policies denying them the right to do this, since those organizations could be liable too. So it quickly gets into the legal realm.
If I could prove medical damage from the higher dosage, perhaps an ambu- lance chasing malpractice lawyer would take it on contingency. But who would I get to certify "damage" but the endo who herself MAY be responsible, directly or through her staff?
As usual, the little guy outside the organization is at a distinct disadvantage. The cards are stacked....Or am I missing some opportunity to pursue this?
Thanks, and Happy New Year (as I've heard it said) to all,
Brian
_____________________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
--- On Mon, 12/28/09, Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. <Type-2-Diabetes@com yahoogroups. > wrote:com
> From: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. <Type-2-Diabetes@com yahoogroups. >com
> Subject: [Type-2-Diabetes] Digest Number 3842
> To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
- 5b.
-
Re: Metformin Overdose
Posted by: "ron42nm" ron42nm@gmail.com ron42nm
Fri Jan 1, 2010 8:04 am (PST)
Brian, let's back up here. I don't remember everything you've written here and the YG search engine isn't working, but as I recall, you haven't discussed this with your doc. That is obviously the first thing to do. If a dose was given that is twice what he prescribed, he's going to be just as anxious as you to get to the bottom of it. I certainly would be.
As far as Judy's comments about misunderstanding orders, that is very rare these days since the famous Dana Farber case about 20 years ago. Most prescriptions are written electronically now. The software raises a red flag if dosage limits are exceeded. Somewhere the system broke down.
If there was an error, make a written complaint to the appropriate state licensing board - medicine, nursing, pharmacy. They will investigate. Believe me, they take this stuff very, very seriously.
As far as records being altered, no medical professional in their right mind would do that. If caught, you go to jail and lose your license to practice forever. It's not worth it to avoid a malpractice suit that your malpractice insurer pays.
The organizations these people work for cannot forbid them to testify under oath. Under oath they must tell the truth or suffer the legal consequences, which aren't pretty. Again, it just isn't worth it.
As far as affording a lawyer, typically lawyers in tort cases work on a contingency basis. In other words, they don't get paid if they don't win. If they win, they typically take a third or more of the award. If a lawyer in this situation asks you to pay him on an hourly basis, he knows you have no case and just wants to make some money.
Finally, unless you have suffered significant injury you have no case. Injury is an absolutely necessary prerequisite to winning a malpractice case. As they say in pickup basketball, "no harm, no foul." The courts will kick it to the licensing boards.
One last thing. You seem to ascribe the worst intentions to everyone involved. I've done a lot of medical risk management work, and I can tell you that the opposite is true. When an error occurs, almost always everyone is very anxious to figure out why and correct the system problem that allowed it to happen.
Ron
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , brian cooper <brianevans_com 99@...> wrote:
>
> Syd, Jude & Others,
>
> Sorry I couldn't thank you sooner for your suggestions about dealing with this upsetting and unsettling SNAFU.
>
> Short of hiring a lawyer, which I can't afford, I have real doubts about what I can do alone. Don't you think that whichever party is responsible--med school or pharmacy, professional or staffer--will point the finger elsewhere, and try to alter their records? Are they really going to admit to me that they were responsible? Even if they were ethical enough to do so personally, the organizations they work in doubtless have policies denying them the right to do this, since those organizations could be liable too. So it quickly gets into the legal realm.
>
> If I could prove medical damage from the higher dosage, perhaps an ambu- lance chasing malpractice lawyer would take it on contingency. But who would I get to certify "damage" but the endo who herself MAY be responsible, directly or through her staff?
>
> As usual, the little guy outside the organization is at a distinct disadvantage. The cards are stacked....Or am I missing some opportunity to pursue this?
>
> Thanks, and Happy New Year (as I've heard it said) to all,
>
> Brian
> _____________________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
>
>
> --- On Mon, 12/28/09, Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. <Type-2-Diabetes@com yahoogroups. > wrote:com
>
> > From: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. <Type-2-Diabetes@com yahoogroups. >com
> > Subject: [Type-2-Diabetes] Digest Number 3842
> > To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
>
- 5c.
-
Re: Metformin Overdose
Posted by: "Jude" peridotjude@yahoo.com peridotjude
Fri Jan 1, 2010 10:27 am (PST)
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , brian cooper <brianevans_com 99@...> wrote:{{Brian was given a prescription for metformin by the pharmacist at his WalMart with the wrong dosage-- instead of 2000mg a day, the Rx was for 4000mg}}}
<< Short of hiring a lawyer, which I can't afford, I have real doubts about what I can do alone <snip>If I could prove medical damage from the higher dosage, perhaps an ambulance chasing malpractice lawyer would take it on contingency. But who would I get to certify "damage" but the endo who herself MAY be responsible, directly or through her staff>>
Was there actual damage done? I never got the feeling from your posts that anything untoward actually happened because of this mistake; did I misunderstand?
This is a good life lesson for all of us who take prescription meds-- when the doc prescribes a new drug, we need to write down the name of it, the dosage, and the instructions, getting the info directly from the MD. Then when we pick up the med, we need to make sure the pharmacy label matches what we were told. The drug labels nowadays also often have a description of what the med inside should look like-- "small white tablet", that kind of thing.
And finally, if we're ever handed a med that looks different from what we've been taking, we definitely need to question it before using the new supply. Mistakes DO happen, naturally.
Judy D.
- 5d.
-
Re: Metformin Overdose
Posted by: "AnaLog Services, Inc." analog@logwell.com sydlevine
Fri Jan 1, 2010 11:52 am (PST)
You have to have damages to sue. I doubt you have any real damages, though Dr, Ron could speak to that (but probably will refrain as a matter of professional courtesy). Metformin is fairly benign stuff as evidenced by the fact that folks take a couple or three grams a day for years with no serious ill effects.
Of course you could sue in an effort to teach em a lesson, but as you probably suspect, no contingency fee plaintiff's lawyer would be interested in that. Personally, I would be pushing for am answer because that is the sort of pushy sob I am. I would make em squirm a little just for the satisfaction of watching em. My goal would to make em worry about what they have done at least as much as you have been forced to worry about it, but that's just me.
Syd
----- Original Message -----
From: brian cooper
To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
Sent: Friday, January 01, 2010 2:33 AM
Subject: [Type-2-Diabetes] Metformin Overdose
Syd, Jude & Others,
Sorry I couldn't thank you sooner for your suggestions about dealing with this upsetting and unsettling SNAFU.
Short of hiring a lawyer, which I can't afford, I have real doubts about what I can do alone. Don't you think that whichever party is responsible--med school or pharmacy, professional or staffer--will point the finger elsewhere, and try to alter their records? Are they really going to admit to me that they were responsible? Even if they were ethical enough to do so personally, the organizations they work in doubtless have policies denying them the right to do this, since those organizations could be liable too. So it quickly gets into the legal realm.
If I could prove medical damage from the higher dosage, perhaps an ambu- lance chasing malpractice lawyer would take it on contingency. But who would I get to certify "damage" but the endo who herself MAY be responsible, directly or through her staff?
As usual, the little guy outside the organization is at a distinct disadvantage. The cards are stacked....Or am I missing some opportunity to pursue this?
Thanks, and Happy New Year (as I've heard it said) to all,
Brian
_____________________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _
--- On Mon, 12/28/09, Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. <Type-2-Diabetes@com yahoogroups. > wrote:com
> From: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. <Type-2-Diabetes@com yahoogroups. >com
> Subject: [Type-2-Diabetes] Digest Number 3842
> To: Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. com
- 5e.
-
Re: Metformin Overdose
Posted by: "Dorothy Wurth" dottie.wurth@yahoo.com dottie.wurth
Fri Jan 1, 2010 11:55 am (PST)
Hi Brian,
Several years ago I had a similar experience with my doctor's office and Glyburide. At my quarterly exam, my A1C was really good, 5.0. The doctor said that if I stayed that low, we should consider reducing medication. When I picked up my next prescription, it was for half the regular dose. I pointed out to the pharmacist that it was wrong. He called my doctor's office and was told that the RX was correct. I accepted that and continued to take the Glyburide as prescribed. I was at fault too, because I wasn't testing my bg regularly. When I went to the doctor again, my A1C had gone up considerably. He checked my chart and discovered the problem. He had decided to go to a paperless charting system and was in the middle of changing all of his records at the time of my last visit. To save money, he had hired high school students to enter the data from the charts into the computer. They had made a mistake when entering my information.
By catching that mistake, it gave him warning that he had better double check all of the entries. Except for the elevated A1C, I was not harmed. I realise that I was at fault because if I had been checking my glucose readings like I should, I would have caught the mistake much earlier. I did end up changing doctors for this and several other reasons. I hope you were not harmed because of your doctor's SNAFU. Congratulations for catching the error before that happened.
Dottie
- 5f.
-
Re: Metformin Overdose
Posted by: "ron42nm" ron42nm@gmail.com ron42nm
Fri Jan 1, 2010 1:11 pm (PST)
No, Syd, I wouldn't comment because I don't have enough information on Brian's medical condition. It's got nothing to do with "professional courtesy," whatever that is supposed to mean. I try very hard in all things to not make judgments until I have all the necessary information. You can get in all sorts of trouble making hasty judgments.
Ron
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , "AnaLog Services, Inc." <analog@...> wrote:com
>
> You have to have damages to sue. I doubt you have any real damages, though Dr, Ron could speak to that (but probably will refrain as a matter of professional courtesy).
- 6.1.
-
Re: rant about BG swings - Holly :)
Posted by: "Wee K Chew" wee@weekhiong.plus.com wee_khiong
Fri Jan 1, 2010 7:59 am (PST)
Holly,
" I also wonder what the lurkers and newbies think of that.
Will they be willing to share their concerns, questions, problems..."
You are a very good person ((( Hugs )))
I enjoy reading your posts and has come to trust you :)
I am learning a lot from all the discussions on here.
I can't contribute much as I am "learning".
Rest Assured, I will throw concerns, questions and problems if I need to.
If you recall, I threw some posts on here already :)
Happy with my Self Management now, hence a Lurker now :)
Finally, I just want to say & wish you all ;-
"Happy New Year!"
& hope the New Year brings plenty of Prosperity
and Well Being for all of us :)
Kind Regards,
Wee :)
Middlesex, UK
T2, 1g Metformin(twice daily) + 80mg Gliclazide
1hr walking daily(split in two half hr session)
Last HBA1C 6.5
- 7.1.
-
Holly - rant about BG swings
Posted by: "barbhealth2008" barbhealth2008@yahoo.com barbhealth2008
Fri Jan 1, 2010 8:04 am (PST)
Hi Holly:
For me, a normal reading BEFORE eating might be 90
after I eat -- 2 HOURS after I eat, the reading is usually 120 or even 130 or 140.
So that is a raise in levels of 30 on average or even 50.
Then an hour later it keeps going down.
Personally I don't feel immediately sick after a few minutes have passed since I started eating. I don't feel dizzy or anything.
I'm wondering if some other things might be going on when you eat:
(1) Do you drink a lot of water during the day? If a person is dehydrated from drinking very little water/fluids, then they will become dizzy and feel faint, etc. often throughout the day. It can make you feel like you are going to collapes.
(2) You might be allergic to something your're eating? The kind of reaction you describe could be an allergic reaction. I've known people who are allergic to wheat. They couldn't even eat Campbells soup because there was wheat in most of it. I've known people who had all sorts of food allergies, and foods have triggered off all sorts of horrible side effects, making them extremely ill feeling.
What are the types of foods you are eating? I would keep a list of them, and the ingredients in them.
(3) If you are not breathing in deep breaths, your body might need more oxygen, and that can make you feel dizzy, etc. It can make you feel drunk not getting enough oxygen.
(4) If you are menopausal, you might feel a hot flash, etc. after eating -- this is because you can now "feel" the heat that is generated in your body when food is being ingested and digested -- the same heat that was always being generated, but before menopause you just couldn't feel it. Sorry I don't have the source of this information around -- but that is what I read.
(5) Maybe you have high blood pressure? If you are eating something high in sodium, this can make you feel really sick. Or even just having high blood pressure alone, without eating sodium, could cause you to feel drunk.
(6) If you have anxiety -- this can make a person feel really, really sick. I have discovered that I have anxiety -- and what you describe sounds similar to an anxiety attack. If in the back of your mind you are nervous about the food you are eating, and your blood sugar levels, then eating could trigger an anxiety attack.
(7) Acid reflux can cause people to feel jittery and all sorts of things.
(8) Have you been tested for asthma? If you are not getting enough oxygen due to your lung capacity not being big enough, that will make you feel dizzy.
(9) You might have another issue lingering on like gall bladder problems or something? I have no idea, but there are so many different things that go on, and I am convinced that only very knowledgeable specialists can figure a LOT of this stuff out.
What I have found is that most doctors just don't have all the answers. And even if they do, they don't have the time to explain things, or they don't have the skills to explain things well.
I have tried to read about things as much as I can -- but I also post questions to groups like this -- and have gotten a lot of great help from members of groups like this, because people are willing to take the time to share what they know, and many times give you the name of sites that are out there explaining things.
I personally did a ton of searches about "digestion" and I learned a lot of the different things people might "feel" when they are eating or after they are eating.
I firmly believe that the medical profession does have a fairly good idea right now about the standards of blood sugar levels, etc. and that they say NOT to look at your sugar levels for 1 hour or 2 HOURS after you eat -- not to pay attention to what level it is a few MINUTES after you eat. Personally, I believe them.
We have to put our faith and trust in someone -- and I really believe they are probably right about this.
If I was experiencing what you are describing -- I personally would keep a journal of everything I ate and how I felt afterward, because it could be certain foods triggering it. I also would STOP taking my glucose levels a few minutes after eating -- and would wait 1-2 hours after eating (recently they changed it to 2 hours as being the time to measure it because I guess it goes up even higher after 1 hour.)
I would immediately get evaluated by a psychiatrist, and see if they have a short acting anti-anxiety medication that you could try to take, and take it 1/2 hr. before eating, and then see how you feel after you eat, if it's any better.
I'd also get tested for acid reflux, etc.
I'd talk to as many doctors as I could about the whole thing until I was satisfied with an explanation. Hopefully you will come up with an explanation and a method to deal with it --
My guess is that there is another condition you have ALONG WITH the diabetes that is causing this.
Good luck!
Barb
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , Holly Shaltz <holly@...> wrote:com
>
> Here's my rant. It helped me to let off some
> steam. Maybe it will also explain where I'm
> coming from better than all the well-reasoned
> arguments in the world....
>
> <rant on>
>
>
> I'm TIRED of people telling me 30 points isn't a
> BG swing or spike!!!!! What does anyone else know
> about how it feels to ME? It's like going from
> fine to dead drunk in the space of 5 minutes,
> without any of the fun of getting there - not even
> eating a couple fun carbs!!!! And it happens from
> ***3*** lousy grams of carbohydrate at breakfast!!!!
>
> Does anyone *else* on this list have this happen?
> In all the posting I've done on forums and
> lists, no one has *ever* said yeah, that happens
> to me, too, and it's the pits! No, I get told,
> over and over, it's not a spike, it's not a swing,
> you should be a T1 on insulin and then you will
> know what a *real* swing is! <growling loudly>
> Including my PA, which was NO help at all.
>
> And so then I tried to communicate it to her and
> others in terms of percentages - how's this for a
> swing: going up 30% of my starting BG in 5
> minutes? Is *that* enough to count? But noooo,
> of course it isn't. How about this: if it hit
> while I'm driving, I would be seriously impaired
> and very likely unsafe to drive? No, that doesn't
> count either.
>
> Like everyone else living with diabetes, I
> struggle to find the balance between controlling
> the disease and its ravages, dealing with the
> complications of decades of undiagnosed, untreated
> disease, and what quality of life I might be able
> to fish out of the mess. To me, tight control of
> my BG is the *only* thing that makes my life
> livable today. Without that tight control, my BG
> whooshes up and down, making me feel woozy at
> best, unable to think, to concentrate, to do
> anything productive - IOW, making my life worse
> than it was when I was obese and had an A1C of
> 11.1. And we do know that fluctuations can be as
> much at fault for damage to the body as sustained
> high numbers - maybe more.
>
> We each and every one of us have to choose our BG
> goals based on the information we learn, and
> ***what our bodies can deal with***. Just because
> the ADA says up to 180 post prandial is fine
> doesn't make it so for me or anyone else - we all
> realize that, right? So what makes 140 better?
> or 120? It might work for some - lucky you if it
> does! It doesn't work for me.
>
> <rant off>
>
> Now for a second cup of tea, a deep breath, and in
> 30 minutes, some T'ai Chi to ease my bodily aches
> and mental sufferings!
>
> Holly in MI
>
- 8.1.
-
Rant about BG swings brings positive feedback from lurker to Holly
Posted by: "Michael Garmaise" mgarmais@yahoo.com mgarmais
Fri Jan 1, 2010 8:14 am (PST)
Well, right now I still consume too much carbohydrate, but I always
want to cut back on them significantly. This is a gradual work in progress,
but I extend at least some credit for my successes to Holly and
her posts.
Holly, your discipline and constant reinforcement are strong motivators.
I read your posts with great interests and thank you for the time you take
to share information and insights.
Sincerely, and with best wishes for a Happy 2010 --
Michael
- 9.1.
-
Diane - Re: glucose reading ups and down Q. Insulin?
Posted by: "barbhealth2008" barbhealth2008@yahoo.com barbhealth2008
Fri Jan 1, 2010 8:47 am (PST)
Hi Diane:
I tried eating like that too at dinner, no grains, etc. but my numbers were going up anyway. The doctor said it was "dawn phenomenon" and that some people's bodies think they're starving to death if their glucose levels go a bit low, so then your liver or something releases a big bunch of something and it raises your glucose levels (sorry I'm not being more scientic in my terminology but you could look it up.)
I'm wondering about the oatmeal. Have you tried just having a few teaspoons of it? Do you drink a lot of water after you eat it?
Anything I eat that has a lot of fiber like oatmeal or bran or something, if I don't drink a lot of water, it makes my levels go up. It has even made my blood pressure go up, because it absorbs all the water in my stomach, and then I get dehydrated, and the dehydration causes high blood pressure.
Exercise helps too.
When you eat the oatmeal, I'm assuming you eat it plain, with only water added? If you add milk you're adding carbs, and any sweetener has carbs or sugar too obviously which raises the glucose levels.
If you add fruit, then of course fruit had sugar and carbs too.
Thanks in advance for clarifying that for me, I'm just wondering about it.
Barb
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , Diane Moro <deemoro@...com > wrote:
>
> Hi Barb!
> I used to worry a lot about that morning number, but I finally realized that
> the best way to get a lower reading in the AM is to eat less at dinner
> (portion control) and NO grain carbs. If I have any grain carbs in the day,
> I make sure they are in the AM or lunch, nothing with dinner. Then my
> readings stay below 105, I have even seen numbers below 100. I like starting
> my day with those numbers.
> Having said that, these holildays have been a killer. Everywhere there are
> homemade cookies. So many parties, special dinners, lunches, etc. Boy, why
> the heck must we always celebrate with food...yikes.
> So I've been off some. I never make resolutions, but I gotta get back on
> track.
> I take no meds yet, so I have to really have to watch my carbs.
> btw oatmeal, no matter how I make it, always gives me a spike, so I've had
> to ditch it.
> Like you said, challenging.
> ~diane
>
> On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 4:48 PM, barbhealth2008 <barbhealth2008@...>wrote:
>
> > Hi All:
> >
> > I had a fantastic wake up glucose reading! 106
> >
> > I'm so glad about that, because many times I have the dawn phenomenon, and
> > my numbers are up first thing in the morning, and that sure puts me in a bad
> > mood because I have to figure out what to have for breakfast that has barely
> > any carbs. The only thing there is just about is low-carb yogurt, or nuts.
> > Oatmeal made just with water and nothing added can be okay sometimes
> > because the fiber count off-sets the carbs and so it doesn't usually make my
> > numbers go up. Then I have to drink a lot of water just to end up with
> > normal numbers (if I'm lucky) 2 hrs. after I eat.
> >
> > This is a really challenging disease.
> >
> >
>
- 10.1.
-
Tiamat- beefalos Re: rant about BG swings
Posted by: "barbhealth2008" barbhealth2008@yahoo.com barbhealth2008
Fri Jan 1, 2010 8:50 am (PST)
Hi Tiamat:
would you mind if I asked what you are eating now that you feel so much better?
What were the foods you were allergic to?
Just curious.
Oh, and what type of doctor did you go to and get tested for the food "sensitivities"?
Thanks!
Barb
--- In Type-2-Diabetes@yahoogroups. , Tiamat <tiamat99@..com .> wrote:
>
> I understand your frustration...what I don't get is why even bother with others' opinions and upset yourself?
> Clearly you have found a wonderful woe that works for you, keeps you well and happy. What does it matter what others say?
>
> Many yrs ago I was just about totally incapacitated, couldn't drive, couldn't work, chronic digestive probs, had many med tests and nothing could be found. Long story....then one day my dh said' ya know..that sounds like food allergies." Went to his pal ENT doc who was specializing in new diagnosis of food sensitivities and sure enough, had several severe shows. I had to eliminate so many foods that little was left and so I made my own woe: a beefalo burger for bkfst and a beefalo burger for lunch and a supper of meat, vegetable or salad...and that's it.
> I lost fifty pounds [of overweight], lost every ache and pain, gained energy, clarity, well-being.. returned to work, to living, to enjoying.
> Everyone I knew thot I was nuts: I carried Beefalo burgers with me everywhere, wouldn't eat anything else, only drank green tea [just about unknown then, had to go to Oriental markets to find]. People made fun of me, told me it was totally dangerous etc. Doctors especially were outraged at the thought of food allergies: thy insisted that there were only a few food allergies: seafood, eggs, wheat and only these quacks and con-men talked about food allergies...But people were getting sick and so gradually it became a compromise: you could call it food sensitivities but not allergies... even then it was barely tolerated as more than a fad ['usually involving neurotic women' they said] .. [since most of our social life involved other docs it was a pretty constant PITA].
> But I got well, I got happy, I got energetic, cheerful, ..name any good thing.
> I returned to my profession, I made my own clothes, made jewelry, made dinner parties, made every day a party.
>
> I can picture people bringing it up every once in awhile: "Whatever happened to that crazy woman who carried burgers in her purse, poor dear...she musta died from it. "
>
> So what does it matter what anyone thinks [beyond a
> short reasonable consideration to evaluate the opinion.]
> Why even bother being annoyed? Why waste the energy?
> Go your own way, have your good results, have your happy life...no one has to agree, or accept what you do.
> Have a few set phrases to save energy: Well, this works for me. This keeps me well. Thnx for your opinion. Doctor's orders ;-D etc.
>
> Tiamat
- 11.1.
-
Holly-another thought - Re: rant about BG swings
Posted by: "barbhealth2008" barbhealth2008@yahoo.com barbhealth2008
Fri Jan 1, 2010 8:53 am (PST)
Hi Holly:
Another thought I just had was that my Endocronologist said that I shouldn't get my body dependent on really restrive diets because then when I did eat a bit more, the numbers would jump! She totally advised not to keep things SUPER low, or OVERLY low, because then the numbers would really jump and be dangerous.
The body takes time to adjust -- it can take 3,4,5 or 6 weeks to adjust to a diet change. Even if you switch medications, your body could take that long to respond to a new medication. The same with increase and decrease in exercise. And WATER is really, really important. Numbers go up really high if with don't have enough water. and FIBER.
Do you get much fiber? Sausage and cheese has no fiber. That might be part of the problem too.
There are things high in fiber like oatmeal -- even a few teaspoons of oatmeal might help. Or dry cheerios (oats)
A trisciut craker is very high in figer
A few shredded wheat cereal squares have fiber.
If desperate -- even the products at the pharmacy like medamucil or something you can drink -- add it to your water -- that might help too.
Do you exercise 1/2 hr. after you eat? Or before you eat? That could make a big difference too!
See what I mean, it's pretty complicated.
Not to mention like I said before the possibility of acid reflux, or a gall bladder problem, etc. etc.
Good luck and keep us posted please!
Barb
- 12.
-
Holly's rant
Posted by: "Dorothy Wurth" dottie.wurth@yahoo.com dottie.wurth
Fri Jan 1, 2010 10:25 am (PST)
Holly,
I sincerely apologise that my post hurt your feelings. That was not my intention in any way. I think I must have totally misunderstood what you were saying in your "rant." I thought you were complaining about the way you are feeling with your bg swings. Now, I think, I realise you were complaining about the lack of understanding the world at large has for your complaints. I repeat, I AM SORRY I MISUNDERSTOOD AND HURT YOUR FEELINGS.
Dottie
- 13a.
-
Re: Statin Drugs/hair falling out?
Posted by: "Katherine Walker" KWALKER5@nc.rr.com sighnsmile
Fri Jan 1, 2010 11:52 am (PST)
Amal, what did you mean about hair falling out?
Katherine
" This issue was discussed at length with my endo but he was not able to convince me to take them. Those on statins have to take COQ1o as the drugs deplete the body of this vital nutrient. Others may think I am foolish not to take statins being border line high but to me it is better to get a heart attack and die than see my hair falling off like one of my friends (i.e, if high cholesterol is the culprit in the first place!). My quality of life is more important than anything else. But that is just me!!
Amal "
- 13b.
-
Re: Statin Drugs/hair falling out?
Posted by: "Amal" amal_mba10@yahoo.com amal_mba10
Fri Jan 1, 2010 1:31 pm (PST)
--- On Fri, 1/1/10, Katherine Walker <KWALKER5@nc.rr.com > wrote:
Amal, what did you mean about hair falling
out?
******************** Hair thinning.
A.
- 14.
-
year-end report
Posted by: "Holly Shaltz" holly@shaltzfarm.com hollyshaltz
Fri Jan 1, 2010 12:17 pm (PST)
I keep daily logs of BGs, food eaten, and
exercise, as well as a monthly summary sheet. I
also keep copies of all my lab tests and a summary
page of the test results for easier reference.
Usually it takes me a few days (OK, sometimes most
of the month :) to get around to catching up the
monthly paperwork, but since today is New Year's
Day, I both had time and motivation to do it sooner.
So, at the beginning of 2009, I weighed 172; this
morning, 142. Only a 30-pound loss over 12
months, but hey, I'll take it! <g>
My A1C going into Jan 09 was 6.5; going into Jan
10 it's 4.9.
My average fasting BG for the month of Dec 08 was
129.4; Dec 09, 80.8.
I only started doing a bedtime BG fairly
consistently in Jan 09 and it was 122; Dec 09, 87.4.
And my exercise stayed pretty similar - about 70
minutes on average in Dec 08, 65 in Dec 09.
I'm really pleased with where I am today. I'd
*like* to lose another 20 pounds, but I'm not
going to worry about it. Chances are pretty good
that I'll have lost that by the end of this coming
summer, just from gardening and eating fresh
home-grown low-carb veggies - how I miss those in
my salads! If not, I'll decide next fall whether
I want to work on losing more weight.
I'm really happy with my fasting and bedtime BGs.
I have no desire to change those from where they
are - though, of course, since they're averages,
there are days that aren't quite so pleasing in
there :) Like the day I had some peanut brittle -
I found out I can *make* peanut brittle just fine,
but don't ask me to break it up into pieces! <g>
Which led to eating 6 cookies. I got on the
exercise bike to forestall the worst of what that
would do to me, but my bedtime was still 102 that day.
I've also analyzed my cholesterol lab results and
have solid progress there, as well. According to
bits I've picked up on the net, ratios of total
cholesterol to HDL, and triglycerides to HDL, are
much better predictors of heart attack risk than
absolute numbers.
For a couple of absolute numbers, though, my HDL
was 38.2 going into 09; 65.6 going into 2010.
Trig was 171 going into 09, 71 at the beginning of
2010.
The "ideal" total cho / HDL ratio is said to be
3.5 and less; mine was 6.7 going into 09, and is
3.6 going into 2010.
The "ideal" triglyceride / HDL ratio is supposed
to be less than 2. It was 4.5 a year ago, now
it's 1.1.
My BP is way down, too - last one that was
properly taken (after 15 minutes of sitting) was
120/80. I don't remember what the first one was,
as I had no frame of reference for the numbers at
the time, but I know it was really high.
Remaining challenge (that I know of at this time -
I'm *sure* more will pop up! :) is to figure out
how much glucose to take to cover my exercise.
I'm going to call my PA next week and tell her to
up my prescription for strips back to 10/day.
That will give me enough strips to do some proper
meal BG profiles to show the endo if she's
interested, and get a better idea on my exercise
needs.
With all its ups-and-downs, I have to say I'm
really pleased with my progress in 2009. I
sincerely hope *everyone* on this list has
progress to report of some sort, too. Even if
it's not numbers that are comforting to look at
quite yet, I hope you have progress of knowledge
and determination.
Holly in MI
Need to Reply?
Click one of the "Reply" links to respond to a specific message in the Daily Digest.
*** All information discussed on this list is not to be taken as medical advice but the experience of each member based on discussions with their doctors. ***
*** Please always consult with your doctor about what treatment options are best for your situation. ***
*** Please always consult with your doctor about what treatment options are best for your situation. ***
Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required)
Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Individual | Switch format to Traditional
Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe
No comments:
Post a Comment